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Forum:Will gay romance options hurt canon?
I was reading a bit on some other sites and people seem to be mad that some characters are going to suddenly turn gay in the 3rd game, However i disagree with this, garrus for example never says "Shepard i'm straight". So you can't imply their 'turning' gay in part 3 they could have been gay all along, i mean in mass effect 2 us male shepards never see garrus getting it on with a woman, and in ME3 female/straight shepards wont she garrus getting it on with a guy either, so does it really ruin the canon? i dunno what are your guys' thoughts? (it's not confirmed garrus will be a same sex romance option, i'm just using him as an example. Um . . . we kind of do hear about a sexual past frpm Garrus, well at least one certain occasion. He mentions having a stress induced rivalry with a female turian on his squad before a risky mission that was very heavily implied to have ended with the two in bed. More then one way to work off stress.--Ironreaper 00:07, January 31, 2012 (UTC) it doesn't matter as long as garrus is a male romance option i'll be happy. also garrus better be the one receiving, if you catch my drift...--Algonquin Native 00:14, January 31, 2012 (UTC) It would be best I think that such romance options should be with new characters. I admit, I do not know what has already been confirmed in ME3 regarding the crew. I avoid as much info on ME3 as I possibly can, but to try and explain action in the previous games, I dunno how well that would turn out. Unless it just ends up the guy plays both ways. Garrus would just seem odd to me. You have seen him in both games, spent a lot of time with him, and then, at the end of the conflict with the Reapers, him and Shepard finally decided to celebrate with a homosexual relationship? Doesn't fit. I don't see it fitting with current established characters. All seem to have established interest in females via comments at one point during the two games. --CrasVox 00:43, January 31, 2012 (UTC) yes but look at Zevran from Dragon Age: Origins (another bioware game) , he talks about falling in love with a woman, but the male warden can still romance him, so it's not impossible that Garrus had feelings for male Shepard, but hasn't acted upon them until ME3--Algonquin Native 01:18, January 31, 2012 (UTC) :I think it will be quite off-putting if ME1 characters like Garrus, Kaidan or Ashley turn out gay. Not because there's anything wrong with that, but because it will feel false, given that lack of any indication in previous games, where romances have been possible. Not to say necessarily that their failure to mention same-sex relationships doesn't mean they haven't had them. :Some characters there could be some leeway, like Jack, who is established as, at the very least, bi-'curious'. :I suspect however that any Male-Male romances will be with new characters or previously minor or non-romanceable characters who's romantic inclinations are a mystery. :I wouldn't be surprised if Vega is a Male romance option, for example. It would also be quite an interesting deconstruction of his buff manly image. :I also suspect romances might work a bit differently, given the smaller squad yet mentions of 'more' romance options. So when we see how that works that might explain some things.JakePT 02:32, January 31, 2012 (UTC) This is another example of someone assuming that sexual attraction being black and white. You're assuming that, from birth, people are either straight, gay, or bisexual. Sexuality is a moving target. Yes, sometimes, people are completely adverse to the thought of being in a relationship with someone of the same sex, but for some people, it might be possible for them to develop feelings toward someone of the same sex. Think about it from Ashley or Kaidan, or hell, anybody else on the Normandy's perspective. If someone like Shepard came around and saved their ass multiple times and treated them like the most special person to them in the entire world, who's to say that they couldn't develop feelings for them, even if they are the same sex? And Garrus has never specifically stated that he's straight. The only information we know about his past sex life is that tie-breaker he had with a turian woman. All I'm saying is, if somebody went through all the shit they've been through with Shepard, why wouldn't they be able to develop feelings for them? ESPECIALLY if Shepard was interested in them, and pushed the relationship forward? --HellfireDezzy 02:59, February 1, 2012 (UTC) :Oh, absolutely. There's nothing in the existing fiction that would make a same-sex Ashley and Kaiden romance impossible, or even unlikely. :My concern is that fiction generally works a bit differently, because there are different rules about how characters are established etc. :The big one being that we can see behind the scenes. Knowing about the calls for same-sex romances and hearing them promise one, it will kind of feel like they're breaking the fourth wall when characters suddenly open up to new romances. :I know I won't be able to see those characters become available for same-sex romances without thinking "Gee, the only reason this is happening is to pander to fans". It would just be too transparent.JakePT 04:19, February 1, 2012 (UTC) Ok, diverting from the debate over Garrus' sexuality, let's look at this from a gameplay perspective. Between the first two titles, you have a total of ten Love Interest options (excluding Morinth and Kelly) among your squadmates. Of these, there are two that are available for romance by both male and female Sheps: Liara and Samara, who are both mono-gendered asari, and thus only opposed to romancing either form of Shepard if not pursued or approached appropriately. Now, in theory, in order to choose from the romance options presented ME3, a player would either have to opt out of romancing any prior characters, remain utterly faithful to their LI from ME1, or dump/cheat on their current LI. This leaves us with a handful of possibilities, not the least of which is the capability of old teammates coming out of the galactic closet for Shep, as Dezzy put it earlier. For new characters like James Vega and whomever else shows up, they would fall under the "no prior romance" or "dumping/cheating" love lines, and to this point, have no back story to promote their sexuality one way or the other. To answer the question from my own perspective, I do not believe opening sexual orientation possibilities will harm canon in any way. However, I do believe that a player can cause some severe emotional calamity amongst the crew and potential allies if they so choose by jaunting off with another LI. Also, I totally see Kaidan going gay. Just putting that out there, since he was supposed to be in ME1.--Kentasko 07:29, February 2, 2012 (UTC) Honestly, I can't see eigher Garrus or Kaidan going gay, theyre more bro, less bromo. However, Vega or a Salarian, ""cough Solus cough"" i could see. (hmm, never had same sex experience. Requires research. Further testing required) If i wanted to try human, id try you. Just a thought. And i want to romance kasumi. Shes awesome. BeoW0lfe| :I thought it was striking how in ME2 Tali now showed an interest in Shepard. Not a hint at that at all in ME, but I guess with her pilrimage over and done, she is now what seems a full fledged special ops for the Fleet, and with Shepard being spaced and all, she has built up a bit of a crush. It would just seem odd to me if an old character can be a gay romance. After spending two full games with Garrus, just never get the feeling there is anything there. Kaidan you spend maybe 1 and 1/24 of a game, so that would be more of a less jarring revelation. But if they find a way to make it seem like a natural progression for these characters, then fine by me. I just worry about it feeling forced, that is all. Dont want to play it and get to a point where I say to myself, "So here is how they implemented the gay romance." Funny enough, i wanted a Tali romance from day one. I figured her codex spewing Was just a defense mech, cus i do the same thing sometimes. I think kaiden going gay would depend on how much you treated him like a friend. If you ignored him, but saved him anyway, he could be gay, but if you spoke to him all the time, he'd treat you like a bro, not a bromo. BeoW0lfe 15:49, February 2, 2012 (UTC) Let's not forget that in ME2 Garrus comments to FemShep if romanced that he's not interested in humans in general, just Shepard. I think that may be the route that Bioware will go if earlier characters come out for ME3--Shepard is just that amazing. Also, I do seem to recall hearing that there were originally plans to make both Ashley and Kaidan swing both ways in ME1 but it got scrapped for some reason, so that could be imagined in-universe as like their internal feelings that they're only now coming to terms with. 02:58, February 3, 2012 (UTC) :Really guys, LOL? It will hurt cannon? You guys do know it's fiction, right, LOL? I mean its great story but you do know that its also not one writer, right? Now come to think about it way be part of the problem. One word, Deception. There not writer God, with a laptop, saying, "This is what CAN be. This is what can NOT at all... no no no." The whole point is to give the player a choice. The PLAYER has to connect to the characters after all. :As far as I know ALL Shep romance are not cannon but I put it to you, what is cannon so far? There are so many choices. Its true you stories should keep to rules or people get upset. Again, one word, Deception. Same thing happens if you watching a film and then a scene comes on that's doesn't fit with the theme/characters. It really doesn't need to be there in a film. You know the feeling you get when you ask, "Why is that there, is a really bad film". :The problem I see is Shep. Here me out on this.... he/she is the player, there choices, there experience, so every person has an different idea or view of what Shepard is because they feel they know he/she really well through there experience. your right Ash & Kaidan were, but in mass effect 2 they also thought about it but again didn't do it. However people still can if you want to download Gibbed Save Editor, though I never done it and have no idea how to do it. DeadpoolShep 12:53, February 3, 2012 I think the only problem is how it's approached. If every crew member is suddenly flinging themselves at Shepard it will seem dumb, so really it needs to be something Shepard brings up him/herself without obvious lead ins. That should really apply to all non-romanced former crew members too. Personally I prefer the idea of having the sexuality of each character set aside from the protagonist, but I understand wanting to make all options available for the big finale. I suppose that does leave the option open to flirt with everyone, but no reason Shepard couldn't be a bi-sexual slut with enough sex appeal to turn anyone's head regardless of species or gender if that's what the player wants. Fenrisfil 18:27, February 4th, 2012 Here's a thought, how about we all stop worrying about it and if you want to have homosexual relationship with your shepard then go ahead and if you don't, well guess what you don't have to. --Iiams571 06:47, March 5, 2012 (UTC) Not as if you HAVE to make your mShep gay just because there will be an option to. If you have issues with homosexuality or just isn't interested in it then don't choose that option. Simple. How it would mess with canon I have no idea. I mean, all of us have different playthroughs. I for one have never romanced anyone with my mShep.so to me it would make sense if he turns out to be gay. Everyone have a different canon from each other, and my mShep being gay doesn't mess with your mShep not being so.--Ser Mea 18:29, March 5, 2012 (UTC) Note: it IS cannon for Tali to have some level of attraction to shep regardless of gender. (see shadow broker files) BeoW0lfe 18:40, March 5, 2012 (UTC) Lets be honest each of us that have play throughs from ME1 have a pretty good idea about the sexuality of our Shepard, mine for instance is straight and loyal to Ash. What I don't get is people saying canon about the mass effect series. The game is all about choice what you choose to do, that is canon to you and no one else. Some choose to be paragon and nice with a hint of Renegade, others solely a bad ass with the hint of Paragon as something pulls on those cold forgotten heart strings. Roe Parc Ranger BeoW0lfe No Tali is not cannon both ways. Not even sure what "cannon" means. We have canon of course, where she is straight. The Shadow Broker files and her slightly silimar conversation with FemShep is simply not enough to claim she is attracked to both sexes. Believe it or not their are other explanations. Maybe her actions were born purely out of respect and the wish to be like FemShep, her attempt to emulate her leadership, strength and confedence. Maybe they were a response to her being atracked to someone else and she wanted to be more like FemShep to see if that worked. There are a lot of explaination apart from yours. --Ironreaper 22:55, March 5, 2012 (UTC) Having finished the game now, I am happy with the way it was all dealt with. Although as Kaiden is dead for me, I have no idea about that one. But no one (except maybe that bi-sexual reporter) was flinging themselves at me, so that's cool. I didn't like having to decide which of my previous love interests to follow so early on and not being able to change my mind. But ultimately I regret nothing. As much as I've grown to like Liara, I still prefer Tali. The gay romance opening with Cortez was over in a blink of an eye and was a mild opening, so I don't see why anyone would be offended. I also skipped over the opportunity to be turned down by Traynor, no idea how different she'd act with a femshep. As for Tali swinging both ways, I don't think so. The files just make it look like she is curious about human courtship. She didn't download "How to pull your commanding officer". Seeing the info after courting her, it seems that the interest was in you. But the information could just as easily be curiosity about the relationship between Daniels and Donnelly, who she shares Engineering with. After all, they clearly should be together but aren't, so an alien may find it odd. Fenrisfil 09:29, March 12th, 2012 I'm a little amused that some folks are worried about what gender their LI might be in a galaxy where, apparantly, nobody is even bothered by which species you become involved with. Find you happiness with whoever you choose and good luck to you. - Infiltrator N7 02:49, March 13, 2012 (UTC)